Subject: Re: getting Real

From: Jim West <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 05 Apr 1997 18:20:25 -0500 (EST)

At 01:52 AM 4/6/97 -0800, you wrote:

>Of course the oldest MSS should be _taken into account_. But it´s 
>another thing to use antiquity as the sole criterion for establishing 
>the original text.
>

I never said it was!  (gute nacht, du falsche Welt; as Papageno sang before
he put the noose around his neck because no one was listening!)

>
>But the question still remains: _Is_ antiquity in reality "hard 
>evidence" for establishing the _original_ text?? All know that it is 
>evidence for the _existence_ of a certain document or text. 

It simply takes us closer to the original than any of the other criteria.
If it does not, which criteria does?

>-- 
>- Mr. Helge Evensen

Jim

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Jim West, ThD
Adjunct Professor of Bible, Quartz Hill School of Theology
[email-masked]

---

From: "Mr. Helge Evensen" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 06 Apr 1997 04:54:54 -0700

> he put the noose around his neck because no one was listening!)

You´re right! I am aware you would use other criteria _if_ in 
some instances you should have your back against the wall and have no 
other choice. 

> If it does not, which criteria does?

Closer to the original *what*? the original _text_ or the original 
_writing_ (activity) of the NT??

It does indeed take us closer to the _time_ of the writing of the NT. 
There´s no argument there. But the possibility remains that the NT text 
could very well have been corrupted in some MSS at an *early* stage, and 
as long as this possibility is present and since there is no "hard proof" 
to prove _otherwise_, antiquity is not necessarily the *best* criterion.
The earliest papyri do not very often reflect an accurate copying 
activity. And they have a high percentage of disagreements among 
themselves. What if we have had 500 NT papyri? (What a mess!).

So you may freely _prefer_ the antiquity theory, and assert that it is 
the best one, but that does not make it more sure than other 
criteria.....

-- 
- Mr. Helge Evensen