From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 2 10:23:40 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA14459; Wed, 2 Jun 1999 10:23:39 -0400 From: dearing@humnet.ucla.edu Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990602073121.007a5a50@pop4.humnet.ucla.edu> X-Sender: dearing@pop4.humnet.ucla.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 02 Jun 1999 07:31:21 -0700 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: tc-list accuracy of transcriptions Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 990 It is ironic that those commenting on the accuracy of Reuben Swanson's collations misspelled his name. Why not ask Scholars Press to publish an annual leaflet referring to previously published lists of errata and adding new findings? It is, incidentally, not completely impossible for lists of errata to have errors in them. Workers in English literature are familiar with the phenomenon. And why not agree on a system of indicating doubtful letters using the normal keyboard symbols? For example, use dots for illegible letters, with the understanding that there is no way to insure how many letters there are if they are illegible, and question marks after letters that are only partially legible. Workers in English literature use the pointed brackets < > to indicate passages torn or worn away. That seems to me to take care of all possibilities. Letters are legible, partially legible (doubtful), illegible, or missing. Footnotes can explain scribal corrections. Vinton A. Dearing From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 11:42:17 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA23814; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 11:42:17 -0400 Message-Id: Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 17:48:02 +0200 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu References: <199905292057.WAA28534@carno.brus.online.be> Subject: Re: tc-list Mt 17.2 Tatian and Legg X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 320003854441-0001@t-online.de From: U.B.Schmid@t-online.de (U.B.Schmid) Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1268 Jean Valentin wrote: > Dear TC-ers, > > > I have a question about the end of Mt 17.2 "ta de imatia autou egeneto leuka > ws to fws". According to most Greek witnesses, Jesus' clothes became white > "as light". Some witnesses, including D, the old latin and sy.c, have "as > snow" (possible harmo with Mt 28.3). > > Now there seems to be a third variant: "as the lightning" (sicut splendor > fulguris). I met it in one of my Arabic manuscripts, which I suspect to be > closely apparented to some form of the vetus syra. But I didn't find > parallels. My question is: where does Legg meet this variant, as in his > patristical apparatus he mentions that Tatian has it? After going through > most of the diatessaronic editions and repertories of citations I have here, > I found only the two variants mentioned above, but not the third one. Where > did Legg get this information, or is there some diatessaric witness that > escapes me? Jean, did you check the Arabic Harmonies? In D. Plooij, A Primitive Text of the Diatessaron, Leyden 1923, p. 54 I found the following remark (s.v. Mt 17.1f) : "The Arabic Tatian has combined the 'snow' and the 'light of lightning'." ------------------------------------------ Dr. Ulrich Schmid U.B.Schmid@t-online.de From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 12:22:03 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA24860; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 12:22:03 -0400 Message-Id: <199906031626.SAA22035@carno.brus.online.be> Subject: Re: tc-list Mt 17.2 Tatian and Legg Date: Jeu, 3 Jun 99 18:31:49 +0200 x-sender: vale5655@pop3.brus.online.be x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: Jean Valentin To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 917 >did you check the Arabic Harmonies? In D. Plooij, A Primitive Text of the >Diatessaron, Leyden 1923, p. 54 I found the following remark (s.v. Mt >17.1f) : >"The Arabic Tatian has combined the 'snow' and the 'light of lightning'." > Ulrich, You're correct. The Arabic harmony does exactly what you say. I don't = know why I didn't see it - probably because Marmardji ascribes it to = Luke and not to Mt. Interesting is that my Arabic version retains only the lightning, and = not the snow. Thanks for the tip. Jean _______________________________________________________________ Jean Valentin - 34 rue du Berceau - 1000 Bruxelles - Belgique tel. 32-2-280.01.37 e-mail : jgvalentin@arcadis.be _______________________________________________________________ "Ce qui est trop simple est faux, ce qui est trop compliqu=E9 est = inutilisable" _______________________________________________________________ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 13:59:51 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA25575; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 13:59:50 -0400 Message-Id: <199906031805.OAA46092@f04n01.cac.psu.edu> X-Sender: wlp1@mail.psu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.2 Date: Thu, 03 Jun 1999 14:02:14 -0400 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "William L. Petersen" Subject: Re: tc-list Mt 17.2 Tatian and Legg, and some other stuff In-Reply-To: <199905292057.WAA28534@carno.brus.online.be> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 6830 RE Jean Valentin's question (and some other matters): > >I have a question about the end of Mt 17.2 "ta de imatia autou egeneto leuka ws to fws". According to most Greek witnesses, Jesus' clothes became white "as light". Some witnesses, including D, the Old Latin and sy.c, have "as snow" (possible harmo with Mt 28.3). > >Now there seems to be a third variant: "as the lightning" (sicut splendor fulguris). I met it in one of my Arabic manuscripts, which I suspect to be closely apparented to some form of the vetus syra. But I didn't find parallels. My question is: where does Legg meet this variant, as in his patristical apparatus he mentions that Tatian has it? After going through most of the diatessaronic editions and repertories of citations I have here, I found only the two variants mentioned above, but not the third one. Where did Legg get this information, or is there some diatessaric witness that escapes me? > >Thank you for your help. > >Jean V. > I note already Ulrich Schmid's reply; indeed, there is such a variant. In the edition of Marmardji (1935, pp. 228[Arab.] and 229 [French], lines 9-13), the Arabic Diatessaron reads (as per his French translation): "(Mt. XVII,2a) Jesus changea (d'aspect), (Lc. IX, 29b) et devint selon la forme d'une autre personne. (Mt. XVII,2c) Et son visage brilla comme le soleil. (Lc. IX, 29c) Et ses vetements etaient blancs, (Mc. IX,3b) extremement, comme la neige, (Lc. IX,29d) et (etincelaient) comme l'etincellement de l'eclair." Note that Marmardji ascribes the reading to Mark, where it does exsit, as a variant, in some MSS. The reference is from chap. 24 of the Arabic Harmony. Ciasca's edition (1888), pp. 42-43 (Latin translation) also gives the same reading (more or less), also indicated as a harmonization: "Matth. XVII, 2b. et resplenduit facies eius sicut sol, Luc. IX, 29b. et vestitus eius factus [pg. 43] est candidus nimis velut nix, et sicut splendor fulguris." Note that Ciasca ascribes it to Luke. Why, I do not know... This same harmonization also turns up in the West, in at least the Middle Dutch Liege Harmony (I've not taken the time to check any other texts): in Plooij's edition the reference is to page 265, where he gives an extensive apparatus. Plooij notes that the reading--in Matthew--is found in the Sinaitic Syriac (Syr-s; Syr-c deest), the Vetus Latina (ex. *q*), Bezae (already noted by Jean...), the Old-Hebrew (du Tillet), the Old German (*Die Erste Deutsche Bibel,* ed. W. Kurrelmeyer [Tuebingen, 1904]), the Old French (*Bible Historiale*), the Pepysian Harmony. Plooij then goes on to give a *long* list of Marcan MSS which interpolate "as snow." So the reading is well-known (as a pointer, always check the Vetus Latina on such readings, for it is an exceptionally rich tradition for such harmonizations: here, see Juelicher, *Itala--Matthaeus-Ev.* [1938], p. 119, where it is the standard Old Latin reading....). The reading is also that of the Vulgate. Hence, the Western harmonies may well be giving simply the dominant Vetus Latina and Vulgate reading. The *Synopse* (Tuebingen: JCB Mohr, 1981) of Heinrich Greeven (ob. 1990 or so...) also provides an excellent apparatus on this point (he notes additional Greek evidence). This Greek synopsis, which was begun by Albert Huck, has gone through various editions; Greeven presents his own *very* well-constructed text (at many points I prefer it to the NA/UBS text), with his own, very complete and very helpful apparatus. I always keep it on my desk, for it is a very useful complement to the Aland *Synopsis.* I have been on the road a lot recently, and just escaped from the horrors of the end of semester; Jean, your earlier question about Shem-Tob will get an answer, however it will take time to check it all out. This response has (so far) taken over an hour to prepare.... One final remark on the new Comfort book: as I returned, and skimmed through all the e-mail it generated, five thoughts crossed my mind. First, harkening back to something I wrote on the list two or more years ago, not all books are equal, not all scholars are equal. Some people are satisfied with less, some are more demanding. In part, this depends on the level at which one works. For the person who dabbles in textual criticism but never publishes, Comfort may be an interesting addition to their library. For the person who publishes and for whom textual criticism is his or her profession, the book will not be used. Second, accuracy is the name of the game in textual studies. Indeed, every book has errors. But there are three concerns about the errors in this book. (A) They strike at the raison d'etre for the book: it is supposed to be *an edition* of these papyri. These are not minor errors--1914 being printed for 1941, or Berlin printed for the place of publication when it is actually Bonn--these errors strike at the whole purpose of the volume. (B) The errors represent, in some cases, a *decline* in accuracy from the *editio princeps*--something which is astonishing. One would hope that, given the *editio princeps* from which to work, accuracy would only *increase*. (C) More than a few of the errors (as per the lists provided by Maurice Robinson) are significant: whole words being interpolated or omitted (articles, *de*, etc.). This is mind-boggling in an edition. Third, for a recitation of some of the historical errors in Comfort's earlier work, see my review in *JBL* 113 (1994), pp. 529-531, of his *The Quest for the Original Text of the New Testament.* Given the level of scholarly diligence displayed there, the problems with this new volume are not surprising. Fourth, the real danger of such books is that *some* people, unwittingly, will *use* them, and write whole articles, preach entire sermons on the basis of a "reading" found in this "edition"--which proves, in the end, to be nothing more than an error of the editors! This is how nonsense multiplies in textual studies: erroneous or partial or one-sided data in means erroneous or partial or one-sided conclusions out. Serious scholars--and not all people are either scholars or serious--are always horrified by such erroneous information. Pause, for a moment, and think: Have *errors* been a problem with the work of the Muenster Institute? I think not. Their accuracy has been--and I use the word in its very *best* sense--"Teutonic": meticulous, thorough, detailed, exhaustive. We may quibble with what was or was not included in the apparatus of a *pocket* edition--which is what NA-27/UBS4 is; we may argue over what reading they took into the text. But errors? No. Muenster's accuracy is, in an imperfect, error-plagued world, astonishing. That is why its work is and continues to be the "gold standard." --Petersen, Penn State Univ. From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 18:44:30 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA27543; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 18:44:29 -0400 Message-ID: <19990603225028.78427.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.255.105.202] From: Bruce Prior To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list Mt 17.2 Tatian and Legg, and some other stuff Date: Thu, 03 Jun 1999 15:50:27 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 665 Dear William -- I appreciated your recent tc posting about the Muenster folks. I've just completed a draft paper, "Matthew 1:5 in Washingtonianus: the Spelling of Booz," in which I challenge the BOOZ . . . BOAZ reading for W in the Variae Lectiones Minores of NA27. Would you like to see the draft? If so, let me know if your address in the 1998 AAR/SBL directory is accurate. I'll also include a couple of pages from my Freer Gospel transcription/collation "work-in-progress" for your comments. Thanks. Bruce Prior _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 19:19:12 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA27613; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 19:19:11 -0400 Date: Thu, 3 Jun 1999 19:24:46 -0400 From: Mike Bossingham Subject: tc-list References To: tc list Message-ID: <199906031924_MC2-781B-7AC8@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1271 Hi, I'm chasing up references to complete my doctorate - this is the very last thing I have to do - had the viva and it has been accepted providing= I chase up the references. Have managed the vast majority, despite being over 100 miles from my Unversity library, but 5 are causing me problems. I wonder if there isanyone kind enough out there to let me either have the details I am missing or point me to an "open" web site that will give me the information. The remaining references are:- OSBORNE C.D. "Review of IGNT Gospel according to St. Luke, Volume 2" (Nee= d = Journal, Volume, date and pages) PETERSEN W.L. "The New Testament in Greek: The Gospel according to St. Luke. Part = One: Chapters 1-12: Part Two: Chapters 13-14" Journal of Biblical Literature. (Need = volume, date and pages) PETZER J. "The Oxford Greek New Testament - A Review Article" = Neotestamentica(Need volume, date and pages) CLAASEN, W.T. On Coping with Information, in Information Management in th= e = Forestry Industry (need publisher and date) VANHOVE-ROMANIK, C. "A Bibliography of Bible and Computer" Centre = Informatique et Bible, Maredsous, 87-164 (need date) Thanking you in advance for your help on this Regards Mike Bossingham MikeBossingham@Compuserve.com From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 3 20:49:44 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id UAA27967; Thu, 3 Jun 1999 20:49:44 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990604005229.0073ce24@utc.campuscw.net> X-Sender: cierpke.utc@utc.campuscw.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 03 Jun 1999 20:52:29 -0400 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "Kevin W. Woodruff" Subject: Re: tc-list References Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 2429 1988 Type: Review Bible (NT), Greek: The New Testament in Greek: The Gosp According to St Luke, 2 V Journal of Biblical Literature 107:758-762 D 1988 xvi,299;iv,262 Oxford: Clarendon Pr, 1984-1987 The New Testament in Greek, 3 Journal of Biblical Literature ISSN: 0021-9231 I've not been able to track down the others Kevin At 07:24 PM 6/3/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hi, > >I'm chasing up references to complete my doctorate - this is the very >last thing I have to do - had the viva and it has been accepted providing >I chase up the references. > >Have managed the vast majority, despite being over 100 miles from >my Unversity library, but 5 are causing me problems. > >I wonder if there isanyone kind enough out there to let me either have >the details I am missing or point me to an "open" web site that will >give me the information. > >The remaining references are:- > >OSBORNE C.D. "Review of IGNT Gospel according to St. Luke, Volume 2" (Need >Journal, Volume, date and pages) > >PETERSEN W.L. "The New Testament in Greek: The Gospel according to St. >Luke. Part >One: Chapters 1-12: Part Two: Chapters 13-14" Journal of Biblical >Literature. (Need >volume, date and pages) > >PETZER J. "The Oxford Greek New Testament - A Review Article" >Neotestamentica(Need volume, date and pages) > >CLAASEN, W.T. On Coping with Information, in Information Management in the >Forestry Industry (need publisher and date) > >VANHOVE-ROMANIK, C. "A Bibliography of Bible and Computer" Centre >Informatique et Bible, Maredsous, 87-164 (need date) > >Thanking you in advance for your help on this > >Regards > >Mike Bossingham > >MikeBossingham@Compuserve.com > > Kevin W. Woodruff, M.Div. Library Director/Reference Librarian Professor of New Testament Greek Cierpke Memorial Library Tennessee Temple University/Temple Baptist Seminary 1815 Union Ave. Chattanooga, Tennessee 37404 United States of America 423/493-4252 (office) 423/698-9447 (home) 423/493-4497 (FAX) Cierpke@utc.campuscw.net (preferred) kwoodruf@utkux.utcc.utk.edu (alternate) http://web.utk.edu/~kwoodruf/woodruff.htm From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 02:36:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id CAA29250; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 02:35:59 -0400 Message-Id: Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:41:54 +0200 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list Mt 17.2 Tatian and Legg X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 320003854441-0001@t-online.de From: U.B.Schmid@t-online.de (U.B.Schmid) Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1015 Jean Valentin wrote: > >did you check the Arabic Harmonies? In D. Plooij, A Primitive Text of the > >Diatessaron, Leyden 1923, p. 54 I found the following remark (s.v. Mt > >17.1f) : > >"The Arabic Tatian has combined the 'snow' and the 'light of lightning'." > > > Ulrich, > > > You're correct. The Arabic harmony does exactly what you say. I don't know > why I didn't see it - probably because Marmardji ascribes it to Luke and not > to Mt. > Interesting is that my Arabic version retains only the lightning, and not the > snow. Jean, have you considered the possibility that Marmardji is correct in ascribing the reading to Luke 9.29? How would you translate the participle EXASTRAPTWN (ASTRAPH meaning "lightning", cf. the Latin composita with "fulgens" or "scoruscantia" [d])in Syriac/Arabic? Maybe your Arabic manuscript (and/or its Syriac Vorlage) simply got harmonized with the Lukan account. Just a guess... ------------------------------------------ Dr. Ulrich Schmid U.B.Schmid@t-online.de From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 06:59:42 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id GAA00471; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 06:59:42 -0400 From: "Wieland Willker" To: "TC-List" Subject: tc-list A translation cannot can be better? Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 13:02:27 +0200 Message-Id: <000101beae79$bb978da0$67566686@chemie.unibremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 2272 I have come across this King-James-Only FAQ: http://www.aloha.net/~bstaggs/kjb-faq.html Oh, well... Some highlights: "A translation cannot only be "as good" as the originals, but better." "The English language had been developing for many centuries until the late sixteenth century. About that time it finally reached a state of excellence that no language on earth has ever attained. It would seem that God did the rest. He chose this perfect language for the consummation of His perfect Book." "The two most prominent of these, Vaticanus, which is sole property of the Roman Catholic Church, and Sinaiticus, are both known to be overwhelmed with errors. It is said that Sinaiticus has been corrected and altered by as many as ten different writers. In Vaticanus is found the evidence of very sloppy workmanship." "Most existing manuscripts of the Bible are divided into two "families." These families are generally represented by the cities of Alexandria, Egypt; and Antioch, Syria. The two Bibles, in manuscript form, and their corresponding ideologies originate in two vastly different locations in the Middle East-- Alexandria, Egypt; and Antioch, Syria. Discerning which location gives us the perfect Bible and the correct ideology and which gave us the devil's bible and incorrect ideology is one of the easiest tasks imaginable." "QUESTION: Aren't today's scholars better equipped to translate the Bible than the King James translators were? Most Christians agree that the world, with time, degenerates. Morals have degenerated since 1611. Character has degenerated since 1611. Even our atmosphere has degenerated. Are we then to believe that education has gotten better? Only a worshipper of education could pretend to believe such a fairy tale. Education has degenerated along with the entire world system and could never produce a scholar equal to those of nearly four hundred years ago." "Now, it will be noted that, there are some Bible colleges and universities which have a policy of confiscating books which support the view of a perfect Bible." Hear, hear! Enjoy it all at the above URL. Best wishes Wieland -------------------- mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 07:19:45 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id HAA00542; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 07:19:44 -0400 Message-Id: <199906041124.NAA13909@carno.brus.online.be> Subject: Re: tc-list A translation cannot can be better? Date: Ven, 4 Jun 99 13:29:31 +0200 x-sender: vale5655@pop3.brus.online.be x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: Jean Valentin To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 697 >I have come across this King-James-Only FAQ: >http://www.aloha.net/~bstaggs/kjb-faq.html > >Oh, well... > Strange indeed... The morality of the story is that you need to know = English in order to be a good christian... Thanx a lot for us all who = speak other languages! Should we laugh or cry? Jean V. _______________________________________________________________ Jean Valentin - 34 rue du Berceau - 1000 Bruxelles - Belgique tel. 32-2-280.01.37 e-mail : jgvalentin@arcadis.be _______________________________________________________________ "Ce qui est trop simple est faux, ce qui est trop compliqu=E9 est = inutilisable" _______________________________________________________________ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 07:29:13 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id HAA00563; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 07:29:12 -0400 From: Kaitbr@aol.com Message-ID: <2010a04f.248913c4@aol.com> Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 07:34:28 EDT Subject: Re: tc-list References To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 338 I would suggest contacting the library at www.bts.edu. It is the Bangor Theological Seminary library in Bangor, ME... It never hurts to ask, and I know they have a great librarian who can probably help you find what you are looking for..... good luck! Kait Bragdon-Roe Peaks Island, ME 04108 Bangor Theological Seminary - Student From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 07:42:34 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id HAA00620; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 07:42:34 -0400 From: Cook@AKAD.SUN.AC.ZA Organization: University Stellenbosch To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:55:24 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: tc-list Re: AIBI-6 Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199906031805.OAA46092@f04n01.cac.psu.edu> References: <199905292057.WAA28534@carno.brus.online.be> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Message-Id: Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1307 Dear list-members As you all probably know by now the AIBI (Association Internationale Bible et Informatique)-6 congress will take place in Stellenbosch, SOUTH AFRICA 17-21 July 2000. I have had good reaction from collegues working in the fields of Hebrew Bible and Septuagint, even though we would welcome additional proposals. However, as far as the NT goes not many have reacted upon my call for papers. I am still trying to find someone who will be willing to take responsibility for the keynote address. I would appreciate it very much if someone would come forward in this regard. The level of academic activity concerning the NT is high on this list (as is the HB and LXX). I would welcome you all to Stellenbosch. This will present a perfect opportunity to see SOUTH AFRICA. The International SBL meeting will take place in Cape Town just after AIBI-6 from the 24-28th of July. Cape Town is 50 km from here!! With kind regards Johann Cook Prof. Johann Cook Department of Ancient Studies UNIVERSITY OF STELLENBOSCH, PRIVATE BAG X1 MATIELAND ZA-7602 SOUTH AFRICA TEL:(0027-21) 8083203; 8083207 FAX: (0027-21) 8083480 E-mail: cook@akad.sun.ac.za HOMEPAGES: http://www.sun.ac.za/as (Ancient Studies) http://www.sun.ac.za/as/journals/jnsl (Journal of Northwest Semitic Languages) From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 08:10:01 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA00709; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:10:00 -0400 From: "Mark Goodacre" Organization: The University of Birmingham To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 13:15:31 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: tc-list References Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199906031924_MC2-781B-7AC8@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <18113081106@hhs.bham.ac.uk> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1392 On 3 Jun 99 at 19:24, Mike Bossingham wrote: > I wonder if there isanyone kind enough out there to let me either have > the details I am missing or point me to an "open" web site that will > give me the information. Have you tried THEOLDI, easily the best "open" resource for bibliographical searches in Theology? http://starwww.uibk.ac.at/theologie/theologie-en.html Or, if you can get access to it (which you will be able to, for example), try BIDS: http://www.bids.ac.uk/ For example, I tried one of your references on BIDS and got: TI: THE NEW-TESTAMENT IN GREEK, THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO LUKE, PT 1, CHAPTERS-1-12, PT 2, CHAPTERS-13-24 - INTERNATIONAL-GREEK-NEW- TESTAMENT-PROJECT AU: PETERSEN_WL NA: UNIV NOTRE DAME,NOTRE DAME,IN,46556 JN: JOURNAL OF BIBLICAL LITERATURE, 1988, Vol.107, No.4, pp.758-762 IS: 0021-9231 DT: Book Review CR: INT G REEK NEW T, 1984, NEW TEST IN GREEK Mark -------------------------------------- Dr Mark Goodacre mailto:M.S.Goodacre@bham.ac.uk Dept of Theology tel: +44 121 414 7512 University of Birmingham fax: +44 121 414 6866 Birmingham B15 2TT United Kingdom http://www.bham.ac.uk/theology/goodacre New Testament Web Resources Mark Without Q Aseneth Home Page From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 08:37:37 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA00793; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 08:37:36 -0400 Message-ID: <018E51C0313CD2119D5300062B001AE1BE5B94@doaisd02001> From: "Bauer, Marc" To: "'tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu'" Cc: "'tulip63@juno.com'" Subject: RE: tc-list A translation cannot can be better? Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 06:43:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2407.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 3321 Dear TC-List'ers, The following very snipped post reminds me of the "liberal" bias that some of us fundies take of many of us TC-List'ers. Really for the love of God, I'm not sure who's more dedicated and pure of heart. Of course, _I_ cannot measure the purity or dedication of anyone including myself so I'm continuing to be baffled by this "hee-hee" kind of posting. I'm not wanting to take anyone to task, or at least, don't mean to be seeming to be taking anyone to task: I'm just amused. I did forward the KJV FAQ posting to my independent fundamentalist Baptist preacher of an uncle (Baptist Bible College, Springfield, MO, 1963). He'll get as big a kick out of it as we have gotten. Hope this isn't too-oo-oo off list. Cheerio, ye lassies and laddies, Bauer PS: Tulip is intentional, of course, as is the 63. I know _y'all's_ proud of me. -----Original Message----- From: Wieland Willker [mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de] Sent: Friday, June 04, 1999 5:02 AM To: TC-List Subject: tc-list A translation cannot can be better? I have come across this King-James-Only FAQ: http://www.aloha.net/~bstaggs/kjb-faq.html Oh, well... Some highlights: "A translation cannot only be "as good" as the originals, but better." "The English language had been developing for many centuries until the late sixteenth century. About that time it finally reached a state of excellence that no language on earth has ever attained. It would seem that God did the rest. He chose this perfect language for the consummation of His perfect Book." "The two most prominent of these, Vaticanus, which is sole property of the Roman Catholic Church, and Sinaiticus, are both known to be overwhelmed with errors. It is said that Sinaiticus has been corrected and altered by as many as ten different writers. In Vaticanus is found the evidence of very sloppy workmanship." "Most existing manuscripts of the Bible are divided into two "families." These families are generally represented by the cities of Alexandria, Egypt; and Antioch, Syria. The two Bibles, in manuscript form, and their corresponding ideologies originate in two vastly different locations in the Middle East-- Alexandria, Egypt; and Antioch, Syria. Discerning which location gives us the perfect Bible and the correct ideology and which gave us the devil's bible and incorrect ideology is one of the easiest tasks imaginable." "QUESTION: Aren't today's scholars better equipped to translate the Bible than the King James translators were? Most Christians agree that the world, with time, degenerates. Morals have degenerated since 1611. Character has degenerated since 1611. Even our atmosphere has degenerated. Are we then to believe that education has gotten better? Only a worshipper of education could pretend to believe such a fairy tale. Education has degenerated along with the entire world system and could never produce a scholar equal to those of nearly four hundred years ago." "Now, it will be noted that, there are some Bible colleges and universities which have a policy of confiscating books which support the view of a perfect Bible." Hear, hear! Enjoy it all at the above URL. Best wishes Wieland -------------------- mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 11:30:23 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA01507; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 11:30:22 -0400 Message-Id: <199906041534.RAA23179@carno.brus.online.be> Subject: Re: tc-list References Date: Ven, 4 Jun 99 17:40:13 +0200 x-sender: vale5655@pop3.brus.online.be x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: Jean Valentin To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 726 Concerning the book of Mrs Vanhove, you could write to her at = antiq.vanhove@pandora.be. That's the address of the theological = antiquariate where she works. A good place to write a bibliography... = :-) And the web site is http://www.visitronics.be/vanhove. They have lots = of interesting second-hand books for exegetes. Jean V. _______________________________________________________________ Jean Valentin - 34 rue du Berceau - 1000 Bruxelles - Belgique tel. 32-2-280.01.37 e-mail : jgvalentin@arcadis.be _______________________________________________________________ "Ce qui est trop simple est faux, ce qui est trop compliqu=E9 est = inutilisable" _______________________________________________________________ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 4 16:19:46 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA03049; Fri, 4 Jun 1999 16:19:45 -0400 Date: Fri, 4 Jun 1999 15:23:06 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Prof. Ron Minton" To: TC-List Subject: Re: tc-list A translation cannot can be better? In-Reply-To: <000101beae79$bb978da0$67566686@chemie.unibremen.de> Message-ID: X-X-Sender: rminton@orions0.orion.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 489 On Fri, 4 Jun 1999, Wieland Willker wrote: > I have come across this King-James-Only FAQ: > http://www.aloha.net/~bstaggs/kjb-faq.html I don't mind the KJVOs religion, but it is disappointing to see people so blind they can not see that when two KJVs differ they can not both be "perfect." The concept of don't confuse me with the evidence may also apply to TR onlyism, Alexandrianism, and etcism. (No, you don't want to know what the spell checker offered for the above.) Ron Minton From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Mon Jun 7 01:15:54 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id BAA10845; Mon, 7 Jun 1999 01:15:53 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990607052707.00692d84@sd.znet.com> X-Sender: gipe@sd.znet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 06 Jun 1999 22:27:07 -0700 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: Mark Gipe Subject: tc-list Coptic copy of Mark older than 200CE? Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 236 I read in a travel book on Egypt which I have that there has been found a Coptic copy of John older than 200 CE. Does anyone know any thing about this manuscript. Where can I find more information about this? Thanks alot Mark Gipe From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Mon Jun 7 22:43:19 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA16865; Mon, 7 Jun 1999 22:43:19 -0400 Message-ID: <375C854A.9B511C74@historian.net> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 21:51:54 -0500 From: Jack Kilmon X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list Coptic copy of Mark older than 200CE? References: <1.5.4.32.19990607052707.00692d84@sd.znet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 483 Mark Gipe wrote: > > I read in a travel book on Egypt which I have that there has been found a > Coptic copy of John older than 200 CE. Does anyone know any thing about this > manuscript. Where can I find more information about this? Are you sure it was Coptic? A travel guide to Egypt would probably mention P52. Jack -- ______________________________________________ taybutheh d'maran yeshua masheecha am kulkon Jack Kilmon jkilmon@historian.net http://www.historian.net From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Mon Jun 7 23:41:09 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id XAA17082; Mon, 7 Jun 1999 23:41:09 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990608035233.00696afc@sd.znet.com> X-Sender: gipe@sd.znet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 07 Jun 1999 20:52:33 -0700 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: Mark Gipe Subject: Re: tc-list Coptic copy of John older than 200CE? Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1103 Thanks for your reply Jack Here is the whole quote In the book "Insight Guides Egypt" by Houghton Mifflin Company page 50 under the title "Early Christianity" it says "Such were the conditions in Egypt during the 1st century of the Christian era, when the apostle Mark preached in Alexandria. Remains from the period of the diffusion of Christianity in Egypt are scant, but New Testament writings found in Bahnasa in Middle Egypt date from around the year 200, and a fragment of the gospel of St John written in Coptic and found in Upper Egypt, can be dated even earlier." Mark Gipe > > >Mark Gipe wrote: >> >> I read in a travel book on Egypt which I have that there has been found a >> Coptic copy of John older than 200 CE. Does anyone know any thing about this >> manuscript. Where can I find more information about this? > >Are you sure it was Coptic? A travel guide to Egypt would probably >mention >P52. > >Jack > >-- >______________________________________________ > >taybutheh d'maran yeshua masheecha am kulkon > >Jack Kilmon >jkilmon@historian.net > >http://www.historian.net > > From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 8 08:09:37 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA18815; Tue, 8 Jun 1999 08:09:36 -0400 From: "Wieland Willker" To: "TC-List" , "B-Greek" Subject: tc-list New online GNT Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 14:15:56 +0200 Message-Id: <000001beb1a8$a911f120$67566686@chemie.unibremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 976 I have prepared a new online GNT, which is (I hope) at last an allowed, free version. It is the Westcott-Hort text from 1881, combined with the NA26/27 variants. This version was prepared by Maurice Robinson (originally for the Online Bible) and is published as public-domain. You can find it at: http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/GNT/index.html I am atm improving it a bit by indicating the difficult readings: "Text in red indicates readings, where the UBS editorial committee had great difficulty in deciding which variant to place in the text. Please refer to "A Textual Commentary on the Greek New Testament" by Bruce M. Metzger, 2nd ed.,1994, for the details. The difficult readings are indicated by the letters C and D. To find these positions easy, they are labeled with an asterisk, *." So far I have done the Gospels. Comments highly welcome! Best wishes Wieland -------------------- mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 8 09:50:48 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA19263; Tue, 8 Jun 1999 09:50:47 -0400 From: DrJDPrice@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 09:55:54 EDT Subject: tc-list Greek NT To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 144 Dear Wieland Willker: Thanks for the GNT. However, my unzip programs do not work on the file GNT.zip. How do I unzip the file? James D. Price From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 8 10:28:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA19557; Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:27:59 -0400 From: "Wieland Willker" To: "TC-List" Subject: tc-list Re: Greek NT Date: Tue, 8 Jun 1999 16:34:31 +0200 Message-Id: <000001beb1bc$0522fe60$67566686@chemie.unibremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 426 > Thanks for the GNT. However, my unzip programs do not work on > the file GNT.zip. How do I unzip the file? Hmm..., I checked it and it works on my side. I use the standard Winzip program. Anybody else experience any problems? Btw, all errors in this GNT are mine, not Maurice's. :-) But please tell me! Best wishes Wieland -------------------- mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 8 10:31:08 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA19624; Tue, 8 Jun 1999 10:31:07 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990608153557.008d4710@gpo.iol.ie> X-Sender: mauros@gpo.iol.ie X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 08 Jun 1999 15:35:57 +0100 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "Maurice A. O'Sullivan" Subject: Re: tc-list Greek NT Cc: DrJDPrice@aol.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 551 At 09:55 08/06/99 EDT, you wrote: >Dear Wieland Willker: >Thanks for the GNT. However, my unzip programs do not work on >the file GNT.zip. How do I unzip the file? > >James D. Price > > There is nothing wrong, AFAICS, with GNT.zip, since it unzipped for me with no trouble at all with WIN.ZiP ( i use the Win95 version, but there is a Win31 version available at URL below ). Perhaps you might to visit: http://www.attitude.com/zip.htm and download the appropriate file? Regards, Maurice Maurice A. O'Sullivan [ Bray, Ireland ] mauros@iol.ie From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 9 22:34:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA01594; Wed, 9 Jun 1999 22:33:59 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990610024542.0068e7e0@sd.znet.com> X-Sender: gipe@sd.znet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 09 Jun 1999 19:45:42 -0700 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: Mark Gipe Subject: Re: tc-list Coptic copy of John by Thompson Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1318 To add to my other post Does any one on this list have a copy of "The Gospel of John in Coptic" by H. Thompson 1932 ? Mark Gipe At 08:52 PM 6/7/99 -0700, you wrote: >Thanks for your reply Jack > >Here is the whole quote > >In the book "Insight Guides Egypt" by Houghton Mifflin Company page 50 under >the title "Early Christianity" it says "Such were the conditions in Egypt >during the 1st century of the Christian era, when the apostle Mark preached >in Alexandria. Remains from the period of the diffusion of Christianity in >Egypt are scant, but New Testament writings found in Bahnasa in Middle Egypt >date from around the year 200, and a fragment of the gospel of St John >written in Coptic and found in Upper Egypt, can be dated even earlier." > > >Mark Gipe > > >> > >> >>Mark Gipe wrote: >>> >>> I read in a travel book on Egypt which I have that there has been found a >>> Coptic copy of John older than 200 CE. Does anyone know any thing about this >>> manuscript. Where can I find more information about this? >> >>Are you sure it was Coptic? A travel guide to Egypt would probably >>mention >>P52. >> >>Jack >> >>-- >>______________________________________________ >> >>taybutheh d'maran yeshua masheecha am kulkon >> >>Jack Kilmon >>jkilmon@historian.net >> >>http://www.historian.net >> >> > > From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 10 16:48:47 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA08484; Thu, 10 Jun 1999 16:48:46 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Thu, 10 Jun 1999 13:15:51 -0700 Subject: tc-list Acts 17:26 D* Reuben Swanson From: "clayton stirling bartholomew" To: TC list Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990610205450.YHV2799@[12.73.97.20]> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 301 On page 309 of Reuben Swanson's Acts, the last block on the page showing the end of Acts 17:26 appears to be in error for D*. The other sources I have checked read KAIROUS KATA hOROQESIAN which is omitted by Swanson. -- Clayton Stirling Bartholomew Three Tree Point P.O. Box 255 Seahurst WA 98062 From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Sat Jun 12 22:24:22 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA27780; Sat, 12 Jun 1999 22:24:22 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.02 (298) Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 22:30:13 +0000 Subject: tc-list Re: A translation cannot can be better? From: "Kerry Gilliard" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 http: //1peter315.iscool.net or http://tidalwave.net/~blufunk195 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <199906122231.SM00167@[208.220.25.207]> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 985 Wieland, I got a good laugh out of the page (sadly), but I'm used to seeing that type of material on a regular basis. I've been working on a section on my site (which is still in dire need of updating and corrections which were suggested to me months ago) called NT Issues. It's based on an evangelical Christian point of view. I currently hold a bit of an ecclectic view, but that's starting to change slowly (although it's not present on my pages, which were first uploaded prior to me beginning to study the Majority text view). In any case, I have a bit of a 'reply' to sites like this- it's called 9 ways to beat a dead horse: A Challenge to KJV Only Advocates. You (and everyone else) are welcome to view it at http://tidalwave.net/~blufunk195/nt/kjvonly/9waystobeatadeadhorse.html Kerry Gilliard Founder-Director W.I.T.N.E.S.S. Ministries e-mail: blufunk195@tidalwave.net, witnessministries@mailandnews.com http://tidalwave.net/~blufunk195 or http://1peter315.iscool.net From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Sun Jun 13 00:12:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id AAA28004; Sun, 13 Jun 1999 00:11:59 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 21:13:48 -0700 Subject: tc-list C.K. Barrett Acts Error From: "clayton stirling bartholomew" To: TC list Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990613041808.MUPB26944@[12.73.98.54]> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 301 On page 851 of C.K. Barrett Acts (ICC) he cites Acts 17:30 D(c) TAUTHS PARIDWN. All the other sources cite this as D*. This has been a good week. Two errors in 3 days. Note my previous post on Reuben Swanson's Acts. -- Clayton Stirling Bartholomew Three Tree Point P.O. Box 255 Seahurst WA 98062 From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Sun Jun 13 19:04:32 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA00560; Sun, 13 Jun 1999 19:04:31 -0400 Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 18:14:37 -0500 From: Huey Bahr Subject: tc-list KJV enough already. In-reply-to: <199906122231.SM00167@[208.220.25.207]> X-Sender: 109nrf5ijads@mail10.cwix.com To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Message-id: <3.0.3.32.19990613181437.0069f340@mail10.cwix.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 157 Let's please wrap up the comments about the shortcomings of a 400 year old translation into English and return to our discussions about the original text. From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Sun Jun 13 19:29:35 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id TAA00648; Sun, 13 Jun 1999 19:29:35 -0400 Message-ID: <001301beb5f5$78968d20$237cebcf@shell.com> From: "Mark Proctor" To: References: <3.0.3.32.19990613181437.0069f340@mail10.cwix.com> Subject: Re: tc-list KJV enough already. Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 18:35:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 529 Mr. Bahr refers to "the original text" in his post. Is not this overly optimistic nineteenth century language as outmoded as the arguments of the TR supporters? Mark Proctor ----- Original Message ----- From: Huey Bahr To: Sent: Sunday, June 13, 1999 6:14 PM Subject: tc-list KJV enough already. > Let's please wrap up the comments about the shortcomings of a 400 year old > translation into English and return to our discussions about the original > text. > From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Sun Jun 13 20:47:03 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id UAA00869; Sun, 13 Jun 1999 20:47:03 -0400 Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 20:55:43 -0400 (EDT) From: "Robert D. Haslach" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu cc: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list KJV enough already. In-Reply-To: <001301beb5f5$78968d20$237cebcf@shell.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 96 My mother told me to stay away from ruffians and philologists. Regards, Robert D. Haslach Bye From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 15 11:50:43 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA13552; Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:50:43 -0400 Message-ID: <376675E4.BF289AF7@mailhost.chi.ameritech.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 10:48:52 -0500 From: "Jeffrey B. Gibson" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: graphai CC: ioudaios-l , Synoptic-L , TC-List , johannine_literature , crosstalk2 , Biblical Greek Subject: tc-list ANNOUNCEMENT: the XTalk Home Page Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1021 I am pleased to announce that XTalk: The Historical Jesus and Early Christian Origins, a moderated, academic e-List dedicated to the scholarly investigation and discussion of critical questions and issues surrounding the study of the Jesus of History and the rise of Christianity, now has an official web page. Please visit it at http://www.xtalk.org or at its mirror site at http://www.bham.ac.uk/theology/goodacre/xtalk where you will find a detailed description of the aims and focus of the List, its protocols, and procedures for subscribing. XTalk is the successor to Crosstalk, a now defunct, unmoderated discussion group which sprang up in response to, and continued the discussion begun in, a series of web based exchanges on the Historical Jesus between John Dominic Crossan, Luke Timothy Johnson, and Marcus Borg. The new List continues the legacy of those original exchanges. Yours, Jeffrey Gibson -- Jeffrey B. Gibson 7423 N. Sheridan Road #2A Chicago, Illinois 60626 e-mail jgibson000@ameritech.net From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 16 13:17:04 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA22589; Wed, 16 Jun 1999 13:17:04 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 10:08:21 -0700 Subject: tc-list Fitzmyer Acts 17:34 From: "clayton stirling bartholomew" To: TC list Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19990616172316.RSUE9693@[12.73.98.29]> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 527 J.A. Fitzmyer (Acts, AB page 600) states in his English synopsis of the western text that Acts 17:34 omits "and became believers." I could find no other reference to this omission anywhere, not in Codex Bezae, the Vulgate or any other manuscript cited in any apparatus I have access to. Perhaps Fitzmyer is using some witness to the western text which is not cited in any of the sources I have at hand. Anyone know where he got this reading? -- Clayton Stirling Bartholomew Three Tree Point P.O. Box 255 Seahurst WA 98062 From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 16 16:37:03 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA01627; Wed, 16 Jun 1999 16:37:02 -0400 Message-ID: <002401beb838$dd463dc0$047cebcf@shell.com> From: "Mark Proctor" To: Subject: tc-list Need a Syriac Text Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 15:43:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BEB80E.F3D925E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 3654 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BEB80E.F3D925E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a Syriac copy of Ephrem's = Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23. None of the libraries in the = Houston area have Leloir's critical edition of this text (Saint Ephrem. = Commentaire de l'Evangile concordant. Texte syriaque [Manuscrit Chester = Beatty 709], Chester Beatty Monographs 8 [Dublin: Hodges Figgis, 1963]), = but I have been able to locate Leloir's French translation as well as = McCarthy's English translation. If someone on the list has a copy handy = and could photocopy the relevant passages and send them to me, I would = greatly appreciate it. In the meantime, if one of you could tell me the = Syriac words that Ephrem uses to refer to Jesus' anger (five times in = paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 time in paragraph 22) that would = be equally helpful. If you respond to my second request, just do it by = e-mail and send them in transliterated form since I do not have a Syriac = font. I have a meeting with a professor at Rice University next Monday = to discuss another passage from Ephrem's Hymns on Paradise, and it would = be fantastic if I knew something about the Syriac text of Commentary on = the Diatessaron XXII.22-23 as well. Thanks in advance for any = assistance you can lend me in this regard. BTW, does anyone know where = to find Norman Petersen? Sincerely, Mark Proctor ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BEB80E.F3D925E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a Syriac = copy of=20 Ephrem's Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23.  None of = the=20 libraries in the Houston area have Leloir's critical edition of this = text=20 (Saint Ephrem.  Commentaire de l'Evangile concordant.  = Texte=20 syriaque [Manuscrit Chester Beatty 709], Chester Beatty Monographs = 8=20 [Dublin: Hodges Figgis, 1963]), but I have been able to locate Leloir's = French=20 translation as well as McCarthy's English translation.  If someone = on the=20 list has a copy handy and could photocopy the relevant passages and send = them to=20 me, I would greatly appreciate it.  In the meantime, if one of you = could=20 tell me the Syriac words that Ephrem uses to refer to Jesus' anger (five = times=20 in paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 time in paragraph 22) that = would be=20 equally helpful.  If you respond to my second request, just do it = by e-mail=20 and send them in transliterated form since I do not have a Syriac = font.  I=20 have a meeting with a professor at Rice University next Monday to = discuss=20 another passage from Ephrem's Hymns on Paradise, and it would = be=20 fantastic if I knew something about the Syriac text of Commentary on = the=20 Diatessaron XXII.22-23 as well.  Thanks in advance for any = assistance=20 you can lend me in this regard.  BTW, does anyone know where to = find Norman=20 Petersen?
 
Sincerely,
 
Mark Proctor
------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BEB80E.F3D925E0-- From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 16 16:44:13 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA01673; Wed, 16 Jun 1999 16:44:13 -0400 Message-ID: <004001beb839$de1ad660$047cebcf@shell.com> From: "Mark Proctor" To: References: <002401beb838$dd463dc0$047cebcf@shell.com> Subject: Re: tc-list Need a Syriac Text Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 15:50:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003D_01BEB80F.F4B6E640" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 5155 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01BEB80F.F4B6E640 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I forgot to give my address. It's as follows: Mark Proctor 1723 Hilton Head Dr. Missouri City, TX 77459 Thanks again! ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Proctor=20 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu=20 Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 1999 3:43 PM Subject: tc-list Need a Syriac Text I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a Syriac copy of Ephrem's = Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23. None of the libraries in the = Houston area have Leloir's critical edition of this text (Saint Ephrem. = Commentaire de l'Evangile concordant. Texte syriaque [Manuscrit Chester = Beatty 709], Chester Beatty Monographs 8 [Dublin: Hodges Figgis, 1963]), = but I have been able to locate Leloir's French translation as well as = McCarthy's English translation. If someone on the list has a copy handy = and could photocopy the relevant passages and send them to me, I would = greatly appreciate it. In the meantime, if one of you could tell me the = Syriac words that Ephrem uses to refer to Jesus' anger (five times in = paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 time in paragraph 22) that would = be equally helpful. If you respond to my second request, just do it by = e-mail and send them in transliterated form since I do not have a Syriac = font. I have a meeting with a professor at Rice University next Monday = to discuss another passage from Ephrem's Hymns on Paradise, and it would = be fantastic if I knew something about the Syriac text of Commentary on = the Diatessaron XXII.22-23 as well. Thanks in advance for any = assistance you can lend me in this regard. BTW, does anyone know where = to find Norman Petersen? Sincerely, Mark Proctor ------=_NextPart_000_003D_01BEB80F.F4B6E640 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I forgot to give my address.  It's as=20 follows:
 
Mark Proctor
1723 Hilton Head Dr.
Missouri City, TX  77459
 
Thanks again!
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mark = Proctor=20
To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.e= du=20
Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 1999 = 3:43=20 PM
Subject: tc-list Need a Syriac = Text

I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a = Syriac copy of=20 Ephrem's Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23.  None = of the=20 libraries in the Houston area have Leloir's critical edition of this = text=20 (Saint Ephrem.  Commentaire de l'Evangile concordant.  = Texte=20 syriaque [Manuscrit Chester Beatty 709], Chester Beatty = Monographs 8=20 [Dublin: Hodges Figgis, 1963]), but I have been able to locate = Leloir's French=20 translation as well as McCarthy's English translation.  If = someone on the=20 list has a copy handy and could photocopy the relevant passages and = send them=20 to me, I would greatly appreciate it.  In the meantime, if one of = you=20 could tell me the Syriac words that Ephrem uses to refer to Jesus' = anger (five=20 times in paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 time in paragraph 22) = that=20 would be equally helpful.  If you respond to my second request, = just do=20 it by e-mail and send them in transliterated form since I do not have = a Syriac=20 font.  I have a meeting with a professor at Rice University next = Monday=20 to discuss another passage from Ephrem's Hymns on Paradise, = and it=20 would be fantastic if I knew something about the Syriac text of = Commentary=20 on the Diatessaron XXII.22-23 as well.  Thanks in advance = for any=20 assistance you can lend me in this regard.  BTW, does anyone know = where=20 to find Norman Petersen?
 
Sincerely,
 
Mark = Proctor
------=_NextPart_000_003D_01BEB80F.F4B6E640-- From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 17 09:21:08 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA04415; Thu, 17 Jun 1999 09:21:07 -0400 Message-Id: <199906171327.JAA43970@f04n01.cac.psu.edu> X-Sender: wlp1@mail.psu.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0.2 Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 09:23:00 -0400 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "William L. Petersen" Subject: Re: tc-list Need a Syriac Text In-Reply-To: <002401beb838$dd463dc0$047cebcf@shell.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1808 I'll be happy to check for you, but won't be able to do so until later today or over the weekend (too busy at the moment). I have the text, and will, at that time, try to photocopy the pages (pp. 96-99). Norman R. Petersen is at: 25 Sea Breeze Lane Bristol, RI 02809 e-mail: norman.r.petersen@williams.edu (so the SBL Directory). --William L. Petersen, Penn State Univ. At 03:43 PM 6/16/99 -0500, you wrote: > > I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a Syriac copy of Ephrem's > Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23. None of the libraries in the Houston > area have Leloir's critical edition of this text (Saint Ephrem. Commentaire > de l'Evangile concordant. Texte syriaque [Manuscrit Chester Beatty 709], > Chester Beatty Monographs 8 [Dublin: Hodges Figgis, 1963]), but I have been > able to locate Leloir's French translation as well as McCarthy's English > translation. If someone on the list has a copy handy and could photocopy the > relevant passages and send them to me, I would greatly appreciate it. In the > meantime, if one of you could tell me the Syriac words that Ephrem uses to > refer to Jesus' anger (five times in paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 > time in paragraph 22) that would be equally helpful. If you respond to my > second request, just do it by e-mail and send them in transliterated form > since I do not have a Syriac font. I have a meeting with a professor at Rice > University next Monday to discuss another passage from Ephrem's Hymns on > Paradise, and it would be fantastic if I knew something about the Syriac text > of Commentary on the Diatessaron XXII.22-23 as well. Thanks in advance for > any assistance you can lend me in this regard. BTW, does anyone know where > to find Norman Petersen? > > Sincerely, > > Mark Proctor From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 17 12:46:40 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA06565; Thu, 17 Jun 1999 12:46:39 -0400 From: Pappyhays@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 12:50:48 EDT Subject: tc-list N.T. Graece Inquiry To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 76 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1091 Fellow list members, As a new member to this list, please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Mark Hays. I consider myself to be a serious student of God's word, and that is what has prompted this inquiry. I have of course been using Nestle's (specifically N-A 27th) in my textual criticism / study, and have never had anyone satisfactorily explain a problem that I find in the Introduction. If any list members could help in this area, I would greatly appreciate it. In II. "The Text Of The Edition", Section 2."Critical Signs Used in the Text", in the paragragh describing the use of double brackets (p.50*), I find the following rather dogmatic statement to be peculiar: "Double brackets in the text ([[ ]]) indicate that the enclosed words, generally of some length, are known not to be a part of the original text." The next sentence compounds the problem, but for now, I would greatly appreciate any help that you may be in helping me to understand how this (stated as a ) fact, could be KNOWN. Thanking you in advance I am, Mark J. Hays From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 17 14:42:33 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA09048; Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:42:32 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: waltzmn@popmail.skypoint.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:51:16 -0500 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "Robert B. Waltz" Subject: Re: tc-list N.T. Graece Inquiry Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 2124 On 6/17/99, Pappyhays@aol.com wrote: >Fellow list members, > > As a new member to this list, please allow me to introduce myself. My >name is Mark Hays. I consider myself to be a serious student of God's word, >and that is what has prompted this inquiry. > I have of course been using Nestle's (specifically N-A 27th) in my >textual criticism / study, and have never had anyone satisfactorily explain a >problem that I find in the Introduction. If any list members could help in >this area, I would greatly appreciate it. > In II. "The Text Of The Edition", Section 2."Critical Signs Used in the >Text", in the paragragh describing the use of double brackets (p.50*), I find >the following rather dogmatic statement to be peculiar: > "Double brackets in the text ([[ ]]) indicate that the enclosed words, >generally of some length, are known not to be a part of the original text." > The next sentence compounds the problem, but for now, I would greatly >appreciate any help that you may be in helping me to understand how this >(stated as a ) fact, could be KNOWN. It is not, of course, KNOWN. A better statement would be that the committee is certain that these are additions. In essence, the committee was certain that these passages (Mark 16:9-20, John 7:53-8:11, etc.) are not part of the original text of the New Testament. (Whether they are right is another question, but it's not at issue here. :-) Ordinarily, these passages would have been excluded from the text. However, all the passages placed in double brackets are well-known and (in most cases) well-loved. They are regarded as part of the Christian tradition even if they are not part of the original text of the particular books. By placing the passages in square brackets, the committee was able to dodge the question of canonicity. They said that the passages are not original, but made them available for those who wanted to consider them canonical anyway. A sound political move, if you ask me. :-) Bob Waltz waltzmn@skypoint.com "The one thing we learn from history -- is that no one ever learns from history." From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Thu Jun 17 14:50:04 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA09080; Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:50:04 -0400 From: TonyProst@aol.com Message-ID: <4cfa0fb9.249a9e6f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:54:39 EDT Subject: Re: tc-list N.T. Graece Inquiry To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 4 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 560 In a message dated 6/17/99 11:49:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time, waltzmn@skypoint.com writes: << In essence, the committee was certain that these passages (Mark 16:9-20, John 7:53-8:11, etc.) are not part of the original text of the New Testament. (Whether they are right is another question, but it's not at issue here. :-) >> As point of reference, Nonnos in his Paraphrase of John, c. 450 A.D. does not appear to have had these verses available in the text which he paraphrased. Regards, Tony Prost All Nonnos All Day http://membes.aol.com/tonyprost From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Fri Jun 18 04:42:26 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id EAA12195; Fri, 18 Jun 1999 04:42:25 -0400 From: "DGK TAYLOR" Organization: The University of Birmingham To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1999 09:48:11 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: tc-list Need a Syriac Text Priority: normal In-reply-to: <002401beb838$dd463dc0$047cebcf@shell.com> Message-ID: <2CDA6754F32@hhs.bham.ac.uk> Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1313 > From: "Mark Proctor" To: Dear Mark, In response to your enquiry: > I'm working on a variant in Mark, and need a Syriac copy of > Ephrem's Commentary on the Diatessaron XII.22-23. >... In the meantime, if one of you could tell me >the Syriac words that Ephrem uses to refer to Jesus' anger (five >times in paragraphs 22-23) and Jesus' mercy (1 time in paragraph 22) >that would be equally helpful. ANGER (in order): [22] pwrt' [+ S3M suffix, ie pwrth] ; 'ttpr ; [23] pwrt' [ + S3M suffix] ; 'ttpyr ; 'ttpyr MERCY: rHm' [plural] If any of this, or my transcription, is unclear please let me know. The text is sitting in front of me, so it is easy to check. Best wishes, David *************************************************************************** Dr David G.K.Taylor email: d.g.k.taylor@bham.ac.uk Department of Theology, tel: 0121-414 5666 University of Birmingham, fax: 0121-414 6866 Birmingham B15 2TT, U.K. *************************************************************************** From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 14:15:44 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA00338; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 14:15:44 -0400 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 09:59:29 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Prof. Ron Minton" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew In-Reply-To: <10B402A1862@hhs.bham.ac.uk> Message-ID: X-X-Sender: rminton@orions0.orion.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 212 I am away from the office right now. Would someone please post the email address for the B-Greek and B-Hebrew discussion groups. thanks, Ron Minton 5379 North Farm Road 179 Springfield, MO 65803 (417)833-9581 From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 14:25:24 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA00527; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 14:25:23 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Freedman, Howard" To: tc-list Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 19:30:29 +0100 X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 2244 Thanks for your mail but I'll be away from the office until Monday 28th June. begin 600 winmail.dat M>)\^(C<2`0:0"``$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y`0```````#H``$(@`<` M)0```$E032Y.;W1E+E)U;&5S+D]O9E1E;7!L871E+DUI8W)O`!T``@!)`0$)@`$`(0```$8Q,#-"-D(P,30R140S M,3%"-35!,#!!,$,Y14-&0D8R`#L'`2"``P`.````SP<&`!T`$P`=`#4``@!@ M`0$+@`$`(0```#DW0S`W038V,S,R140S,3%!,C@Y,#!!,$,Y1$8Y034Y`"`' M`02``0`W````3W5T(&]F($]F9FEC92!!=71O4F5P;'DZ("!T8RUL:7-T($(M M1W)E96L@86YD($(M2&5B'0!]_\" MI`/D!>L"@P!0`O,&M`*#)C(#Q0(`8V@*P'-EV'0P(`<3`H!]"H`(SS\)V0*` M"H0+-Q+"`=`@5+D3<&YK!"`"$`7`>0AA1B``P`,1(&)U!4!)!"=L&0)E(&%W M849Y&#`#82!T:!G@;VD!(&EC&>!U`C`#$4TE`B!D&B$R.!J@($HA&U!E+B!] M'.`#`/T_Y`0```(!<0`!````&P````&^PEUT];"V`^\N%!'3M5H`H,GL^_(` M``!*H0`#`"X```````(!\C\!````%@```,D+FDISW-(1M4T`H,GL^_(```!L MGSX```L`"`P`````0``Y`"!VN'9=PKX!`P#Q/PD$```>`#%``0````H```!& M4D5%1$U!3D@````#`!I``````!X`,$`!````"@```$92145$34%.2`````,` M&4```````P`F```````#`#8``````!X`<``!````'@```"!T8RUL:7-T($(M M1W)E96L@86YD($(M2&5B`/@_`0```!$```!&`#E``0````H```!&4D5%1$U!3D@```!````#T``0```!H```!/=70@;V8@3V9F:6-E($%U=&]297!L>3H@ M````'@`=#@$````>````('1C+6QI`#40`0```$$````\0SDP0CE!-$$W,T1#1#(Q,4(U-$0P,$$P0SE%0T9" M1C(T13!%-#5`<&MM9V)I Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA00785; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 15:00:55 -0400 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 15:06:07 -0400 From: Jim West Subject: Re: Out of Office AutoReply: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew X-Sender: jwest@highland.net To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Message-id: <1.5.4.32.19990629190607.006766f8@highland.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 383 At 07:30 PM 6/29/99 +0100, you wrote: >Thanks for your mail but I'll be away from the office until Monday 28th >June. > >begin 600 winmail.dat >M>)\^(C<2`0:0"``$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y`0```````#H``$(@`<` listers- do not open this file- it is a self-replicating virus. +++++++++++++++++++++++++ Jim West, ThD email- jwest@highland.net web page- http://web.infoave.net/~jwest From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 15:10:37 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA00846; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 15:10:36 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19990629141610.010ecd40@postoffice.swbell.net> X-Sender: jstrimm@postoffice.swbell.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 14:16:10 -0500 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: James Trimm Subject: Re: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew In-Reply-To: References: <10B402A1862@hhs.bham.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 1269 b-aramaic can be joined from the b-aramaic webpage at http://www.nazarene.net/aramaic At 09:59 AM 6/29/99 -0500, you wrote: >I am away from the office right now. Would someone please post the email >address for the B-Greek and B-Hebrew discussion groups. > >thanks, >Ron Minton >5379 North Farm Road 179 >Springfield, MO 65803 >(417)833-9581 > > James Trimm ============================================== He who seeks will not cease until he finds, and having found he will be amazed, and having been amazed he will reign, and having reigned he will rest. - The Goodnews according to the Hebrews ============================================== The Society for the Advancement of Nazarene Judaism: PO Box 471; Hurst, TX 76053; USA http://www.nazarene.net A nonprofit organization supported by freewill offerings Check out our e-mail discusion groups. ============================================== The International Nazarene Beit Din http://www.nazarene.net/beitdin ============================================== International Nazarene Congregation Directory http://www.nazarene.net/directory.htm? ============================================== Beit Netzarim Congregation in Dallas/Fort Worth, Texas http://www.nazarene.net/beitnetzarim From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 17:04:26 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA02492; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 17:04:26 -0400 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 17:04:25 -0400 (EDT) From: "James R. Adair" To: TC List Subject: tc-list ATLAS jobs Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 932 I hope you'll forgive me taking a little license as listowner to bring to your attention three technology-related jobs that are currently available. Courtesy of a Lilly grant, the Center for Electronic Texts in Religion (a division of the American Theological Library Association) is putting together a technology team to work on the ATLAS project, a project to digitize 50 years' worth of 50 religion journals. See the CETR Web page for more details. It just might be that a few on the list have not been fortunate enough to find work as a text critic ;-) and would be interested in seeing this information. Please contact me offlist for more information. *********************************************************** James R. Adair, Jr. Director, ATLA Center for Electronic Texts in Religion ---------------> http://purl.org/CETR <--------------- Listowner, tc-list *********************************************************** From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 18:09:07 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA02891; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 18:09:07 -0400 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 17:11:59 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Prof. Ron Minton" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19990629141610.010ecd40@postoffice.swbell.net> Message-ID: X-X-Sender: rminton@orions0.orion.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 291 On Tue, 29 Jun 1999, James Trimm wrote: > b-aramaic can be joined from the b-aramaic webpage > at http://www.nazarene.net/aramaic Thanks James; I still need addresses for the B-Greek and B-Hebrew discussion groups. Ron Minton 5379 North Farm Road 179 Springfield, MO 65803 (417)833-9581 From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 18:51:45 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA02982; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 18:51:44 -0400 Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 18:54:56 -0400 From: Jim West Subject: Re: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew X-Sender: jwest@highland.net To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Message-id: <1.5.4.32.19990629225456.00668cb4@highland.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 454 At 05:11 PM 6/29/99 -0500, you wrote: >On Tue, 29 Jun 1999, James Trimm wrote: >> b-aramaic can be joined from the b-aramaic webpage >> at http://www.nazarene.net/aramaic > > >Thanks James; I still need addresses for the B-Greek and B-Hebrew >discussion groups. join-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu join-b-hebrew@franklin.oit.unc.edu best, jim +++++++++++++++++++++++++ Jim West, ThD email- jwest@highland.net web page- http://web.infoave.net/~jwest From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Tue Jun 29 18:54:51 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA03013; Tue, 29 Jun 1999 18:54:51 -0400 Message-ID: <37794F59.349794@mailhost.chi.ameritech.net> Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 17:57:29 -0500 From: "Jeffrey B. Gibson" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list B-Greek and B-Hebrew References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 497 "Prof. Ron Minton" wrote: > On Tue, 29 Jun 1999, James Trimm wrote: > > b-aramaic can be joined from the b-aramaic webpage > > at http://www.nazarene.net/aramaic > > Thanks James; I still need addresses for the B-Greek and B-Hebrew > discussion groups. > B-Greek is Biblical Greek B-Hebrew is Biblical Hebrew Yours, Jeffrey -- Jeffrey B. Gibson 7423 N. Sheridan Road #2A Chicago, Illinois 60626 e-mail jgibson000@ameritech.net From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 06:27:12 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id GAA06655; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 06:27:11 -0400 From: "Wieland Willker" To: "TC-List" Subject: tc-list UBS about "Earliest NT Manuscripts" Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:32:47 +0200 Message-Id: <000301bec2e3$e54ac580$67566686@chemie.unibremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 599 UBS-Translation, TIC-Talk 43: ---------- Philip Comfort and David Barrett. 1998. The Complete Text of the Earliest New Testament Manuscripts. Baker. This book has been the subject of a lively discussion on the textual criticism listserv concerning the significance of transcriptional errors in assessing the value of such a book. Apparently enough errors have been identified to warrant caution in using the book, at least as a source of manuscript evidence. --------- Best wishes Wieland <>< -------------------- mailto:willker@chemie.uni-bremen.de http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/ From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 08:35:43 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA07636; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 08:35:42 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990630123400.00d16700@utc.campuscw.net> X-Sender: cierpke.utc@utc.campuscw.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 08:34:00 -0400 To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu From: "Kevin W. Woodruff" Subject: Re: tc-list UBS about "Earliest NT Manuscripts" Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 842 I talked to the Baker's representive at the Association of Christian Librarians convention two weeks ago and he was talking about the Comfort/Barrett book. He said Baker was in a quandry over it and seemed to think that they will soon pull the book. He assured me that it would be a frosty Friday in SHEOL/HADES/GEHENNA before Baker would ever again publish anything by Philip Comfort. For what it is worth Kevin Kevin W. Woodruff, M.Div. Library Director/Reference Librarian Professor of New Testament Greek Cierpke Memorial Library Tennessee Temple University/Temple Baptist Seminary 1815 Union Ave. Chattanooga, Tennessee 37404 United States of America 423/493-4252 (office) 423/698-9447 (home) 423/493-4497 (FAX) Cierpke@utc.campuscw.net (preferred) kwoodruf@utkux.utcc.utk.edu (alternate) http://web.utk.edu/~kwoodruf/woodruff.htm From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 12:23:04 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA11128; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:23:03 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:23:02 -0400 Message-Id: <199906301623.MAA11123@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu> >Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 22:31:35 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Prof. Ron Minton" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: tc-list Re: join b-greek Content-Type: text Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 125 Dr. West or anyone, I was unable to subscribe to b-greek and b-hebrew. How do I do it? b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu Ron From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 12:50:50 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA11367; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:50:49 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:50:49 -0400 Message-Id: <199906301650.MAA11360@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu> >Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 11:32:35 -0500 From: "Jeffrey B. Gibson" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list Re: join b-greek Content-Type: text Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 493 "Prof. Ron Minton" wrote: > Dr. West or anyone, I was unable to subscribe to b-greek and b-hebrew. > How do I do it? > > b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu > > Ron For B-Greek and B-Hebrew, go to their Homepages at: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek/index.html http://metalab.unc.edu/bhebrew/index.html respectively, where you will find instructions on subscribing. Yours, Jeffrey Gibson -- Jeffrey B. Gibson 7423 N. Sheridan Road #2A Chicago, Illinois 60626 e-mail jgibson000@ameritech.net From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 12:51:31 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA11395; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:51:30 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:51:30 -0400 Message-Id: <199906301651.MAA11390@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu> >Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 12:45:03 -0400 From: Jim West To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: Re: tc-list Re: join b-greek Content-Type: text Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 605 At 12:23 PM 6/30/99 -0400, you wrote: >Dr. West or anyone, I was unable to subscribe to b-greek and b-hebrew. >How do I do it? > >b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu > > >Ron send a message to join-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu in the body just put subscribe b-greek do the same with b-hebrew join-b-hebrew@franklin.oit.unc.edu subscribe b-hebrew failing that, visit my web site in my sig, follow the mailing list link, and select the lists your interested in. all the info is there. best, jim +++++++++++++++++++++++++ Jim West, ThD email- jwest@highland.net web page- http://web.infoave.net/~jwest From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 17:27:50 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA14510; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 17:27:50 -0400 Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 17:27:49 -0400 Message-Id: <199906302127.RAA14505@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu> >Date: Thu, 01 Jul 1999 06:56:08 +1000 From: "S.D. & J.A. Mannix" To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Subject: tc-list Magazine Subscriptions Content-Type: text Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 832 G'day. Could someone tell me whether there are magazines which discuss Greek and Hebrew please? Regards, Steve Mannix q4402112@topaz.cqu.edu.au At 12:51 30/06/99 -0400, you wrote: >At 12:23 PM 6/30/99 -0400, you wrote: >>Dr. West or anyone, I was unable to subscribe to b-greek and b-hebrew. >>How do I do it? >> >>b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu >> >> >>Ron > > >send a message to >join-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu > >in the body just put >subscribe b-greek > >do the same with b-hebrew >join-b-hebrew@franklin.oit.unc.edu > >subscribe b-hebrew > >failing that, visit my web site in my sig, follow the mailing list link, and >select the lists your interested in. all the info is there. > >best, > >jim > >+++++++++++++++++++++++++ >Jim West, ThD >email- jwest@highland.net >web page- http://web.infoave.net/~jwest > > > > From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 18:40:44 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA14922; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 18:40:43 -0400 From: Pappyhays@aol.com Message-ID: <9caabe83.24abf83c@aol.com> Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 18:46:20 EDT Subject: Re: tc-list N.T. Graece Inquiry To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 76 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 345 Greetings all, Sorry to be so slow to reply, I've been out of town. Tony Prost remarked: "As point of reference, Nonnos in his Paraphrase of John, c. 450 A.D. does not appear to have had these verses available in the text which he paraphrased." To which I might easily reply, "The same can be said of Phillip Schaff" Regards, Mark Hays From owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Wed Jun 30 18:59:54 1999 Return-Path: Received: by shemesh.scholar.emory.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA15095; Wed, 30 Jun 1999 18:59:54 -0400 From: Pappyhays@aol.com Message-ID: <3e428e25.24abfc4d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 19:03:41 EDT Subject: Re: tc-list N.T. Graece Inquiry To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 76 Sender: owner-tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: tc-list@shemesh.scholar.emory.edu content-length: 902 Greetings, Thank you for your responses to my query. I am not trying to trick anyone with "trick" questions. My request was a sincere one, in that I would like to know if any of you have an idea as to how they came to their conclusion about the verses in double brackets. Bob Waltz replied to my original question with (in part): "It is not, of course, KNOWN. A better statement would be that the committee is certain that these are additions" Which of course prompts me to ask," How, were they "certain" of this? I am not asking anyone to defend their decision, but if possible to help provide me with the rationale for it. I cannot ask the commitee members, now can I? I certainly hope that you gentlemen can help, as this is a serious issue that needs to be resolved, in my own mind anyway. Are there any rescources that you know of that might help? Sincerely, Mark J. Hays